[Mkguild] possible MK banner/logo

[C. Matthias]

>Comments?

I rather like Ryx suggestions as to the nature of 
the heraldry as it goes along more with what I 
originally thought and have tried to describe in 
my stories.  However, Alex is also right, the 
heraldry has always featured a horse.

I'm sorry I haven't been more talkative on this 
subject, but I'm getting packed to go to a 
convention and my daughter needs me a lot.

May He bless you and keep you in His grace and love,

Charles Matthias

>
>From: mkguild-bounces at lists.integral.org 
>[mailto:mkguild-bounces at lists.integral.org] On Behalf Of christian okane
>Sent: Friday, March 01, 2013 12:16 AM
>To: 'Alex Green'
>Cc: 'C. Matthias'; mkguild at lists.integral.org
>Subject: Re: [Mkguild] possible MK banner/logo
>
>Ok. So it gets more confusing instead of 
>clearer. BUT A long time ago I actually chatted 
>with the real Thomas Hassan about what Duke 
>Thomas' heraldry was. He gave the following 
>answer A Red Rearing horse on a black 
>background. He deliberately chose something 
>like  the Ferrari car emblem for the Duke. And I 
>have been hating him for that ever since. But 
>Hassan is long gone from MK and I am willing to 
>listen to the people who care about MK - which is us.
>
>
>Chris
>The Lurking Foxc
>
>
>From: 
><mailto:mkguild-bounces at lists.integral.org>mkguild-bounces at lists.integral.org 
>[mailto:mkguild-bounces at lists.integral.org] On Behalf Of Alex Green
>Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2013 9:51 PM
>Cc: 
><mailto:mkguild at lists.integral.org>mkguild at lists.integral.org; 
>christian okane; C. Matthias
>Subject: Re: [Mkguild] possible MK banner/logo
>
>Those are some good suggestions. However there 
>is one point that I must disagree with you on:
>
>
>The adoption of the horse heraldry is new, 
>chosen after the Curse.  Previous to that it 
>could've been anything (I know little of the 
>Hassan house history; griffon or drake would seem likely).
>
>
>The have been a couple stories that indicate the 
>horse has always been a part of the Hassan family heraldry.
>
>This sentence from "Lots" shows how Thomas 
>thinks about being changed to match his heraldry
>
>
>The tablecloth was laced with golden thread, and 
>an artistic blending of the Hassan horse 
>heraldry – he’d always found that terribly 
>ironic after the curse changed him – and the fields and flowers of the valley.
>
>
>And in this scene from "Landing in a New Age", 
>Andwyn finds it strange that Dupré would end up 
>a ram like his family's symbol till Thomas 
>points out the same thing happened to 
>him.  Malisa goes on to say that it's still a very rare circumstance.
>
>“It would be very unusual for the Curse to 
>strike in so coincidental a fashion,” Andwyn mused quietly.
>
>“It happened to me,” Thomas pointed out. “The 
>Hassan coat of arms has always featured a rearing horse.”
>
>“But not to any of your other vassals,” Malisa 
>pointed out. “Perhaps this is a sign to us as 
>well as to him. If he is truly changed to 
>reflect his family’s sigil, then he may be meant to stay here and serve you.”
>
>
>I missed the above reference to a rearing horse 
>in my previous search, so it would seem that 
>Matt originally used a rearing horse as the 
>symbol and only later started describing it as a horse-head.
>
>-AlexSurikat
>
>On Thu, Feb 28, 2013 at 8:18 PM, Ryx 
><<mailto:sundansyr at yahoo.com>sundansyr at yahoo.com> wrote:
>Let's try this:
>The banner of Metamor itself, alone, not 
>withstanding of the ruling House is a castle of 
>three towers, below each a gate.  Gray on green 
>(castle stone, valley green).  The shape of the 
>banner itself is up to the tailor making it.
>
>Duke Thomas' banner is a stallion (or just 
>horse) rampant dexter (rearing, facing right) 
>with a bend sinister (bar, crossing opposite the 
>rampant dexter).  The banner itself is blue (for 
>House Hassan), the horse typically red (for his 
>Knighthood), but when placed on the banner of 
>Metamor the horse may be blue.  The top of 
>either banner would have crenelations or 
>'embattled line' to indicate the fortress nature 
>of Metamor.  The remeberance of the Tree Gates 
>may be included below the horse by some 
>symbology on more complex banners.  Usually just 
>three free-standing castle-style arched portals 
>at the feet of the horse, or slightly behind 
>denoting that the Horse, and House Hassan, holds the Keep.
>
>Historically blue meant Truth and Loyalty, and 
>red Martial arms.  Since Thomas rules over a 
>peaceful kingdom over a conquesting one blue 
>would be a more appropriate 
>color.  (<http://www.oshel.com/symbols.htm>http://www.oshel.com/symbols.htm)
>
>
>The adoption of the horse heraldry is new, 
>chosen after the Curse.  Previous to that it 
>could've been anything (I know little of the 
>Hassan house history; griffon or drake would seem likely).
>
>
>From: Alex Green <<mailto:alexsurikat at gmail.com>alexsurikat at gmail.com>
>To: C. Matthias <<mailto:jagille3 at vt.edu>jagille3 at vt.edu>
>Cc: christian okane 
><<mailto:chrisokane at optimum.net>chrisokane at optimum.net>; 
>"<mailto:mkguild at lists.integral.org>mkguild at lists.integral.org" 
><<mailto:mkguild at lists.integral.org>mkguild at lists.integral.org>
>Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2013 5:34 PM
>
>Subject: Re: [Mkguild] possible MK banner/logo
>
>After searching through the archives for a 
>while, I was surprised to find that there aren't 
>very many descriptions of the banner of Metamor.
>
>I found the most complete description at the 
>bottom of the third page of Misha's "Plain and Simple"
>
>Thomas looked to the top of the ruined tower and 
>noticed the flag fluttering in the breeze. It 
>was a black flag with a red rearing horse on it. 
>It was the flag of the House Hassan, Duke of 
>Metamor, King of the Midland, his own banner.
>
>
>LurkingWolf's "Burning Time" also mention a 
>rearing horse on the flag but neglects to mention the colors
>
>It appears Matt is the only one who's described 
>it as a horse-head in both "Gazing through a 
>Barred Window" and "Healing Wounds in Arabarb", 
>but I didn't see any mention of colors from him either.
>
>Raven didn't mention what was on the flag, but 
>he had a different idea about the colors of Metamor in "A Presence of Thieves"
>
>"That isn't the Duke's banner," he said, 
>frowning up at the yellow flags flapping in the 
>breeze. "Metamor's colors are blue and white. 
>Why would they be flying yellow flags?"
>
>
>Matt confirms that blue is a customary color of 
>the Hassan family in the first interlude of "The 
>Last Tale of Yajakali" with several mentions of 
>"Hassan Blue" but never actually states whether 
>it's the color of the banner or not.  (By the 
>way, I just noticed that the title at the top of 
>every page of LOTY has Yajakali spelled wrong as "Yajikali")
>
>The wiki unsurprisingly agrees with Misha since 
>he's the one who added that information on the 
>"Knights of the Red Stallion" page on the 16th 
>of January 2007 (it specifically says that their 
>emblem is the same as the Duke's).  He also 
>added the emblem information to the Duke's page earlier this month.
>
>That is all of the information I could find 
>relating to the flag/banner/emblem of the House 
>of Hassan/Metamor Keep, so it seems the it is a 
>red/blue rearing-stallion/horse-head on a 
>black/white background.  I never noticed how 
>inconsistent its description was before.
>
>-AlexSurikat
>
>On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 4:00 AM, C. Matthias 
><<mailto:jagille3 at vt.edu>jagille3 at vt.edu> wrote:
>At 03:40 AM 2/21/2013, christian okane wrote:
>That is a nice looking emblem but one small 
>problem. The Horse in the emblem has always been red.
>
>Chris
>The Lurking Fox
>
>The only reference to red in the emblem that I 
>am aware of comes from the knightly order "Order 
>of the Red Stallion".  Please provide other 
>official references (Wiki entries do not count).
>
>
>May He bless you and keep you in His grace and love,
>
>Charles Matthias
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